360 story and engine rebuild

[Bebs]

Thank you for the comments guys - I'm rushing out to buy Euro millions ticket now...

 

[lifes2short]

A second issue raised its ugly head when Ed at AV took the inlet manifold apart for a thorough inspection and clean up.
The 8 inlets each have a butterfly opening/plate which are held down by 2 screws..
As you can see from the attached photos one of the plates appear to have a screw missing!
They found the screw wedged in at the corner of the inlet manifold!

wonder if someone has been at inlet in the past and not refitted butterfly screws correctly and when replaced not used thread lock??, to think such a small part and lack of thought/care by technician can cause major engine failure

 

[lifes2short]

Thank you for the comments guys - I'm rushing out to buy Euro millions ticket now...

can you pm me the numbers you choose

 

[Bebs]

wonder if someone has been at inlet in the past and not refitted butterfly screws correctly and when replaced not used thread lock??, to think such a small part and lack of thought/care by technician can cause major engine failure

It’s possible but I’m not aware of any work having been carried out to the inlets over the past 17 years.. I will ask AV what they think.

 

[2b1ask1]

wonder if someone has been at inlet in the past and not refitted butterfly screws correctly and when replaced not used thread lock??, to think such a small part and lack of thought/care by technician can cause major engine failure

Throttle butterflies are VERY difficult to set up properly as the drilling tolerances alone make them prone to being out of position. I had a nightmare on Alexes BMW airhead motorbike and that was only two! Someone had been fiddling. It beggars belief people think they can do these tasks with no experience and yes they are the ones who will not have heard of locktight!

I was rebuilding carbs from an early age and was schooled by my dad (probably 8 or 9 at the time). I do miss carbs but throttle bodies and fuel injection make for much greater reliability and efficiency I accept.

 

[lifes2short]

Throttle butterflies are VERY difficult to set up properly as the drilling tolerances alone make them prone to being out of position. I had a nightmare on Alexes BMW airhead motorbike and that was only two! Someone had been fiddling. It beggars belief people think they can do these tasks with no experience and yes they are the ones who will not have heard of locktight!

I was rebuilding carbs from an early age and was schooled by my dad (probably 8 or 9 at the time). I do miss carbs but throttle bodies and fuel injection make for much greater reliability and efficiency I accept.

I used a company to completely rebuild a pair of triple choke weber carbs a few years ago and to my horror they didn't bother to use any thread lock on all 12 butterfly screws, luckily I noticed and refitted them with thread lock and naturally went ape with the company in question, just mind boggling they would do that

 

[Bebs]

Whilst we wait for the used cover and oil pipe, to replace the corroded ones, AV engineering have turned their attention to the gearbox and in particular the heat exchanger shown below. It regulates the gearbox oil temperature with coolant:



Unfortunately this part is also rather corroded on the inside and will therefore need to be replaced. If it goes properly then the gearbox fills with coolant resulting in a complete gearbox rebuild:



The team at AV subsequently popped the diff out to let whatever fluid is in there drain out before putting it all back together again:

 

[zagatoes30]

This is the right way to do things, when it's all out check and replace everything that needs doing will save a fortune in the future

 

[Bebs]

This is the right way to do things, when it's all out check and replace everything that needs doing will save a fortune in the future

Absolutely and that’s certainly the plan, to replace anything that isn’t up to scratch and get the car back together 100% sound. There are other things that were spotted early on when the car was originally inspected; a new air conditioning compressor is needed as the old original one is leaking and very badly corroded. A new clutch, ring gear and release bearing will be needed as the old ones are badly damaged by oil and coolant ingress. A few suspension ball joints, two new front tyres as they are far too old and some other bits and pieces which I will cover in this thread as we move forward.

 

[Ebenezer]

Very interesting and informative thread. Thanks!

I presume that all of this is age/wear and tear?
Is there anything more you could have done in the intervening years to head off some of this as I'm sure that it's been well looked after by you for most of this time?

Something for us with slightly newer cars to bear in mind if planning to keep them until they are 20 with 100K. Would have to be pretty special to warrant this sort of attention!

Eb

 

[Bebs]

Not sure I could have done much more than I did Eb. Perhaps more regular coolant changes would have prevented corrosion in the heat exchanger but as far as the metal pieces from the damaged oil pump cog this clearly could not have been predicted or even prevented. The scored crank obviously could have been prevented by fitting the correct seal and likewise the clutch and release bearing would then have been ok. The air con compressor is 20 years old and simply just worn out. Ball joints are wear and tear items. I guess it’s all par the course with a high rev 20 year old, 105,000 mile engine..

 

[Oneball]

Oil to water heat exchangers are quite a common failure after a decade or so. The old E300Ds were particularly prone.

 

[Bebs]

I collected my GT-S on Saturday from AV after a number of upgrades and service items, more on that over on the Granturismo section.
AV are still waiting for the replacement front engine cover and the little oil pipe mentioned previously.
Some progress on the engine but the team have now turned their attention to the engine bay. Everything is stripped down so that the bay can be repainted and brought back to as new.
The manifolds have been tested and are sound and have been polished, you can see them on the floor to the left of the car.
The attention to detail from these guys is incredible, I am absolutely over the moon with the work being carried out.
Some pics:

 

[zagatoes30]

I collected my GT-S on Saturday from AV after a number of upgrades and service items, more on that over on the Granturismo section.
AV are still waiting for the replacement front engine cover and the little oil pipe mentioned previously.
Some progress on the engine but the team have now turned their attention to the engine bay. Everything is stripped down so that the bay can be repainted and brought back to as new.
The manifolds have been tested and are sound and have been polished, you can see them on the floor to the left of the car.
The attention to detail from these guys is incredible, I am absolutely over the moon with the work being carried out.
Some pics:

View attachment 63650
View attachment 63651
View attachment 63652View attachment 63653View attachment 63654

Good to know it's in good hands

 

[Bebs]

Another update from AV:
The aforementioned bottom cover that was cracked and needed sourcing,rather than pay thousands for a new one, has arrived and has been fitted.

 

[Bebs]

The bushes on the timing belt tensioner arms had completely seized, a common trait on 360s, and since they’re only a few quid they’ve been renewed also.
New Hill Engineering tensioner bearings have also been fitted so that early next week, AV are in a position to fit belts and start dialling in the cam timing.
Looks like it’s all going together nicely.

 

[rossyl]

Wow. This seems like Pandora's Box! I'm guessing you've instructed them to just rebuild anything and everything they can find thats wrong?

Otherwise it feels a bit like going in to fix a broken finger and ending up with a heart transplant!

 

[Oneball]

Beyond the crank seal issue and oil pump drive it just seems normal engine rebuild stuff to me, actually a fair bit less. At 100k you could have expected a fair bit more.

 

[ChrisQP09]

Guess you're looking at a 5 figure sum when it's all said and done?

 

[rockits]

Is it me or does this pic look a bit strange?