Alfa 159 1.9 jtdm

Messages
27,493
#21
Nice. I may need another car :(

Either to stop me taking the GT to the station most days *or* to run to Nottingham most weeks.

C
 

GeoffCapes

Centenary Club
Messages
8,358
#22
Hi Guys, a little update on me looking to buy a car.

I bought a 159 2.0 ti.

Its been brilliant, black with a few extras....getting 48mpg out of it and very smooth.

Went for the 2.0 as everyone i spoke to recommended this over the 1.9
Pic's Dem. You know the rules!
 
Messages
1,238
#23
To paraphrase John Shuttleworth, ‘I can't go back to Alfa Romeo now, that Guilia Veloce's stunning, but im halfway through by Maser, no i cant go back to Alfa Romeo now...'


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Messages
27,493
#24
To paraphrase John Shuttleworth, ‘I can’t go back to Alfa Romeo now, that Guilia Veloce’s stunning, but im halfway through by Maser, no i cant go back to Alfa Romeo now...’


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If I need the Nottingham car, it'll almost certainly be an Alfa

C
 

Priyp

New Member
Messages
5
#25
and the usual EGR valve sticking but you can always blank off and delete with a remap.
re: the remap ... I have just had a new EGR valve fitted to my 159 Sportwagon 2.4 Ti (210bhp). Garage fitted a Genuine Alfa Romeo updated ‘restricted’ gasket to help prevent problems repeating themselves ... I do relatively low mileage and short journeys now (car only done 42k miles). However, car now hesitates when pulling away at low revs (judders ... almost like a mis-fire). Should they have done a wee remap or something with this new gasket ??

Any info/experiences gratefully received. Thanks
 
Messages
4,364
#26
Sounds like the EGR may be leaking air or your DPF is blocked. Are the revs jumping slightly at tick over ? Idle on the 159 2.4 jtd was about 750 rpm from memory. If the rev needle isnt fairly static around 750 rpm ish and is jumping between 600 and 1000 rpm then it sounds like the new egr isnt sealing.

If your car hasnt had a remap and still has a DPF on the exhaust system then the DPF could be blocked.

Three options to sort the DPF.
You can either go to a dealer or alfa specialist and get them to force a regen is one option. Shouldnt cost too much but you can force a regen yourself at home and in most cases will clear the issue.

To force a regen at home ( neighbours may not be happy) with the car static. Start car and allow to warm up. Then press the loud pedal and keep the revs up over 2500 rpm for around 5 minutes. After a few minutes the revs will drop back on their own by approx 300 rpm as the regen starts. At this point apply more revs to above 2500 rpm again and keep the revs steady. The regen will take a few minutes to complete and soot particles being burnt will come out of the exhaust.

You will know the regen is complete when the revs go up without you increasing pressure on the peddle. They will jump up to about from 2500 to 2800 ish rpm. Once it finished allow to drop back to idle and leave ticking over for a minute or so before either test driving or turning the vehicle off.

Next option to force a regen which is more neighbour friendly is take it for a drive on the motorway. Keep the revs high so 3 and 4 gear not 5th or 6th. 75mph in 4th gear should be fine. You will need to do about 15 to 20 miles at higher revs to get the dpf up to temperature and force the regen. Once it triggers the car will go very sluggish and more accelerator will be needed to maintain current speed. You will need to drive through this. It feels like an age but it take about a minute or so and then you should feel the car return to normal. If you happen to do this at night then you will probably see some glowing specs out of your rear window. (Burning soot particles) durinh the regen.

If your doing low milage and short journeys and the DPF is still fitted then it will block up. Car has to regen every 500 to 1000 miles depending on type of use and only gets hot enough to regen on motorways or fast roads.

If the revs drop below around 2200 rpm during a regen the car will cancel the regen.

Try the forced regen first and see if that clears the issue assuming you still have a DPF. If that doesnt clear it and your tick over idle rpm is erratic then then it sounds like the EGR isnt sealing properly.
 
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Trev Latter

Centenary Club
Messages
1,108
#27
re: the remap ... I have just had a new EGR valve fitted to my 159 Sportwagon 2.4 Ti (210bhp). Garage fitted a Genuine Alfa Romeo updated ‘restricted’ gasket to help prevent problems repeating themselves ... I do relatively low mileage and short journeys now (car only done 42k miles). However, car now hesitates when pulling away at low revs (judders ... almost like a mis-fire). Should they have done a wee remap or something with this new gasket ??

Any info/experiences gratefully received. Thanks
If it hasn’t been done, it might be worth getting the long term fuel trims reset. Easy enough to do with the right software (multi ecuscan will do it).
 

Priyp

New Member
Messages
5
#28
Try the forced regen first and see if that clears the issue assuming you still have a DPF. If that doesnt clear it and your tick over idle rpm is erratic then then it sounds like the EGR isnt sealing properly.
Thank you very much for your lengthy and detailed reply, v.much appreciated.
Garage performed a ‘regen’ when fitting new EGR valve to try and cover all bases?
My idle has been lumpy both before and after this event ... but not to the extent you suggest. You are absolutely correct that the engine idles at 750rpm. Would you believe my 9yr old daughter only yesterday said she could feel ‘thumping’ through the seat !! But despite feeling it, the needle barely moves up or down ... certainly not to the extreme of 600~1000rpm or thereabouts.

Some history: I suffered occasional power loss on longer journeys 2 or 3 years ago. Perhaps 4 or 5 times a year (4000miles/annum). Sounds almost like the forced Regen you talk about, but would entail full throttle being required to maintain minimal speed loss and when selecting 4th, maximum rpm was 2500 and maximum turbo boost 0.4bar (quarter deflection). Would last several minutes and then clear. I lived with it for 18mths, mentioned it to garage during service. He asked if car ever stalled on start up; Yes it did. Not always, but sometimes. He diagnosed faulty EGR valve and fitted new one a year ago. Sweet. Problem never re-emerged until 2 months ago, when power loss occurred again, but never cleared, only getting worse until horrendous misfire, smoke out exhasts with engine eventually dying on me on the M23 at Gatwick !! Recovery truck could not restart (MAF valve code present, MAF disconnected, still would not start). Recovered to garage. New EGR & regen. All sorted ... except for this annoying hesitation when (for example) coasting at low power towards a red light, and then accelerating gently when light goes green.

Lumpy idle has been there since before first EGR valve replaced. Two separate glow plugs replaced. One before first EGR valve, and a different one after. Always used SHELL V-Power to help with injectors etc (doesn’t hurt too much with my lower mileage). Occasionally get ABS fault on start up in winter months (which I have read maybe due to poor battery power in colder temps?). Car is 2009 and probably needs it’s 3rd new battery before this winter ??

Crazy question remains ?? Was I experiencing ‘regen’ with my power loss ?? Does that limit turbo boost and require full throttle to maintain perhaps 65mph on motorway ?? Or am I getting all confused again ??

Really appreciate your time . I am learning a lot ...

BRgds
 

Priyp

New Member
Messages
5
#29
If it hasn’t been done, it might be worth getting the long term fuel trims reset. Easy enough to do with the right software (multi ecuscan will do it).
Thank you. Will bear this in mind. Trying to find time to get car back to garage. Work is crazy at the moment ...
 
Messages
4,364
#30
Thank you very much for your lengthy and detailed reply, v.much appreciated.
Garage performed a ‘regen’ when fitting new EGR valve to try and cover all bases?
My idle has been lumpy both before and after this event ... but not to the extent you suggest. You are absolutely correct that the engine idles at 750rpm. Would you believe my 9yr old daughter only yesterday said she could feel ‘thumping’ through the seat !! But despite feeling it, the needle barely moves up or down ... certainly not to the extreme of 600~1000rpm or thereabouts.

Some history: I suffered occasional power loss on longer journeys 2 or 3 years ago. Perhaps 4 or 5 times a year (4000miles/annum). Sounds almost like the forced Regen you talk about, but would entail full throttle being required to maintain minimal speed loss and when selecting 4th, maximum rpm was 2500 and maximum turbo boost 0.4bar (quarter deflection). Would last several minutes and then clear. I lived with it for 18mths, mentioned it to garage during service. He asked if car ever stalled on start up; Yes it did. Not always, but sometimes. He diagnosed faulty EGR valve and fitted new one a year ago. Sweet. Problem never re-emerged until 2 months ago, when power loss occurred again, but never cleared, only getting worse until horrendous misfire, smoke out exhasts with engine eventually dying on me on the M23 at Gatwick !! Recovery truck could not restart (MAF valve code present, MAF disconnected, still would not start). Recovered to garage. New EGR & regen. All sorted ... except for this annoying hesitation when (for example) coasting at low power towards a red light, and then accelerating gently when light goes green.

Lumpy idle has been there since before first EGR valve replaced. Two separate glow plugs replaced. One before first EGR valve, and a different one after. Always used SHELL V-Power to help with injectors etc (doesn’t hurt too much with my lower mileage). Occasionally get ABS fault on start up in winter months (which I have read maybe due to poor battery power in colder temps?). Car is 2009 and probably needs it’s 3rd new battery before this winter ??

Crazy question remains ?? Was I experiencing ‘regen’ with my power loss ?? Does that limit turbo boost and require full throttle to maintain perhaps 65mph on motorway ?? Or am I getting all confused again ??

Really appreciate your time . I am learning a lot ...

BRgds
The occasional power loss symptoms you describe is the regen process.

The DPF is essentially a soot collector. Once it get to around 60% full then the car will try to trigger the regen providing the DPF and car are up to temperature and the car is running for 15 mins or so at 2000 to 3000 rpm. If the paremeters are not met then it will continue to fill up with soot. Eventually it will choke up and trigger an engine management light. The DPF will eventually fail if this keeps happening.

Wurth make a spray cleaner that you spray into the DPF. A garage will do it for you if you dont want to do it yourself.

Alfa in their ultimate wisdom put the DPF filter in the middle of the exhaust under the drivers / passenger seat (thumping noise source possibly that you mentioned)

Drive it like you stole it for 20 mins a month to force a regen and hopefully the DPF isnt already failing. The engine note changes to a moor muted sound when the regen is in process. A bit like cotton wool in your ears change to sound.

The new EGR valve may also be sticking open. Disconnect the EGR valve and see if your symptoms stay the same. If they go away then its the EGR valve again by the looks of it stuck in the open position that wont trigger an engine management light.

If neither the EGR test or regen or both cure it then the next thing to check is the swirl pots / flaps.

The actuator rod may have come off or flaps may have broken.

Pm me if you like and im happy to talk through on the phone if needed.
 

Priyp

New Member
Messages
5
#31
Disconnect the EGR valve and see if your symptoms stay the same. If they go away then its the EGR valve again by the looks of it stuck in the open position that wont trigger an engine management light.

If neither the EGR test or regen or both cure it then the next thing to check is the swirl pots / flaps.

The actuator rod may have come off or flaps may have broken.
Thank you again for reply and offer of help. Just had short break in Cornwall. 230 Miles each way on mway/dual carriageway so a good run. Car ran well except for this annoying hesitation at lower throttle settings, good fuel econ and plenty of pulling power when full chat. No smoking from exhaust. Have just checked actuator road and all 5 swirl flaps. All appears well and moving nicely ?? When you say disconnect EGR valve, do you mean blank it off completely, or maybe just pull electric connection off ??
 
Messages
4,364
#32
J
Thank you again for reply and offer of help. Just had short break in Cornwall. 230 Miles each way on mway/dual carriageway so a good run. Car ran well except for this annoying hesitation at lower throttle settings, good fuel econ and plenty of pulling power when full chat. No smoking from exhaust. Have just checked actuator road and all 5 swirl flaps. All appears well and moving nicely ?? When you say disconnect EGR valve, do you mean blank it off completely, or maybe just pull electric connection off ??
Just pull the electric connection. It should run better if the EGR is at fault.

If the swirl pots look ok then the other two things that could be causing issue.

Fuel filter. Silver canister on the bulk head. If its collected water in it will cause difficult starting and hesitation at low rpm. If its been serviced in the last 12 to 18 months it should be fine but it has been known to be skipped at service. Ive just changed it on a 156 2.4 20v which has now improved starting from cold.

Check the hoses going to the turbo. They can go soft and get pin holes in them.

Im still inclined to think its your EGR valve sticking open.
 
Last edited:

Priyp

New Member
Messages
5
#33
J


Just pull the electric connection. It should run better if the EGR is at fault.

If the swirl pots look ok then the other two things that could be causing issue.

Fuel filter. Silver canister on the bulk head. If its collected water in it will cause difficult starting and hesitation at low rpm. If its been serviced in the last 12 to 18 months it should be fine but it has been known to be skipped at service. Ive just changed it on a 156 2.4 20v which has now improved starting from cold.

Check the hoses going to the turbo. They can go soft and get pin holes in them.

Im still inclined to think its your EGR valve sticking open.
Just checked paperwork ... Fuel Filter replaced last service (17mths & 6000miles ago)

Electric connection pulled on EGR valve. Car started smoothly (with engine fault warning). Idle was smoother. With max throttle, only got 2000 rpm. Could not drive any distance like that. Reconnected and still running with the hesitation at low revs.

Not sure I can do much more ?? Really appreciate yr time & expertise. Will get it serviced and this problem looked into further during summer months and report back. Cheers now.
 
Messages
553
#34
It does sound like swirl flap problem. Try washing up liquid around them to see if it bubbles on boost - they all seem to leak eventually and the best solution seems to be to plug and weld them. Solved a lumpy idle and poor starting on my 2.4